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they contradict us absolutely. If we were to follow in nature's steps and enact that law which held good before the days of Laius,King of Thebes, father of Oedipus. declaring that it is right to refrain from indulging in the same kind of intercourse with men and boysCp. Plat. Laws 636b., Plat. Sym.181-2. as with women, and adducing as evidence thereof the nature of wild beasts, and pointing out how male does not touch male for this purpose, since it is unnatural,—in all this we would probably be using an argument neither convincing nor in any way consonant with your States. Moreover, that object which, as we affirm, the lawgiver ought always to have in vie