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[517a] that we know of nobody who has shown himself a good statesman in this city of ours. You admitted there was nobody among those of the present day, but thought there were some amongst those of former times, and you gave these men the preference. But these we have found to be on a par with ours of the present day and so, if they were orators, they employed neither the genuine art of rhetoric—else they would not have been thrown out—nor the flattering form of it.

Callicles
But still there can be no suggestion, Socrates, that any of the present-day men has ever achieved anything like


Plato. Plato in Twelve Volumes, Vol. 3 translated by W.R.M. Lamb. Cambridge, MA, Harvard University Press; London, William Heinemann Ltd. 1967.

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  • Commentary references to this page (3):
    • Sir Richard C. Jebb, Commentary on Sophocles: Antigone, 71
    • Gonzalez Lodge, Commentary on Plato: Gorgias, 515c
    • Gonzalez Lodge, Commentary on Plato: Gorgias, 520d
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