[339d]
“Then on your theory it is
just not only to do what is the advantage of the stronger but also the
opposite, what is not to his advantage.” “What's that
you're saying?”1 he replied. “What you yourself are saying,2 I think. Let us
consider it more closely. Have we not agreed that the rulers in giving
orders to the ruled sometimes mistake their own advantage, and that whatever
the rulers enjoin is just for the subjects to perform? Was not that
admitted?” “I think it was,” he replied.
1 Τί λέγεις σύ; is rude. See Blaydes on Aristophanes Clouds 1174. The supspicion that he is being refuted makes Thrasymachus rude again. But Cf. Euthydemus 290 E.
2 Cf. Berkeley, Divine Visual Language, 13: “The conclusions are yours as much as mine, for you were led to them by your own concessions.” See on 334 D, Alc. I. 112-113. On a misunderstanding of this passage and 344 E, Herbert Spencer (Data of Ethics, 19) bases the statement that Plato (and Aristotle), like Hobbes, made state enactments the source of right and wrong.
Plato. Plato in Twelve Volumes, Vols. 5 & 6 translated by Paul Shorey. Cambridge, MA, Harvard University Press; London, William Heinemann Ltd. 1969.
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