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[459b]

Gorgias
Yes.

Socrates
But he who is not a doctor is surely without knowledge of that whereof the doctor has knowledge.

Gorgias
Clearly.

Socrates
So he who does not know will be more convincing to those who do not know than he who knows, supposing the orator to be more convincing than the doctor. Is that, or something else, the consequence?

Gorgias
In this case it does follow.

Socrates
Then the case is the same in all the other arts for the orator and his rhetoric: there is no need to know


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