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Here begins the third part of Protagoras' reply: 324E328D In this chapter he begins to show that virtue is in point of fact taught to all by showing that it would be absurd to suppose that it is not.

1. λοιπὴ ἀπορία. For the omission of the article before a relative clause (Heindorf suggested the insertion of after λοιπή) Sauppe quotes Rep. III. 413E φύλαξ αὑτοῦ ὢν ἀγαθὸς καὶ μουσικῆς ἧς ἐμάνθανεν. The ἀπορία was raised by Socrates in 319Dff.

3. διδάσκουσιν. Contrast below 325Bτὰ μὲν ἄλλα διδάσκονται τοὺς υἱεῖς and ibid. τοὺς υἱεῖς διδάσκονται, said of the parents as διδάσκουσιν (in the usual sense of διδάσκονται) is said here and in Meno, 94B. Similarly in Prot. 320Aἐπαίδευε is used where we should expect ἐπαιδεύετο: cf. ἐπαιδεύσατο in Meno, 93D.

διδασκάλων ἔχεται. See note on 319Eabove.

6. οὐκέτι μῦθον ἀλλὰ λόγον. Gorg. 523A ὃν σὺ μὲν ἡγήσει μῦθον, ὡς ἐγὼ οἶμαι, ἐγὼ δὲ λόγον: ὡς ἀληθῆ γὰπ ὄντα σοι λέξω μέλλω λέγειν.

12. δικαιοσύνητὸ ὅσιον εἶναι. Thus for the first time Protagoras definitely speaks of the virtues in language implying their unity: cf. 323E

14. ἀνδρὸς ἀρετήν: ἀνδρός is somewhat loftier and more impressive than ἀνθρώπου (cf. Rep. VIII. 565E βίον ἀνδρὸς ἀφανίζων). For the sentiment cf. Rep. VI. 501B ξυμμιγνύντες τε καὶ κεραννύντες ἐκ τῶν ἐπιτηδευμάτων τὸ ἀνδρείκελον, ἀπ᾽ ἐκείνου τεκμαιρόμενοι, δὴ καὶ Ὅμηρος ἐκάλεσεν ἐν τοῖς ἀνθρώποις ἐγγιγνόμενον θεοειδές τε καὶ θεοείκελον.

15. μετὰ τοὐτου: not μεθ᾽ οὗ, see on 313Aκαὶ ἐν . For the use of μετά cf. Phaed. 69A ff. (μὴ) ἐκεῖνο μόνον τὸ νόμισμα ὀρθόν, ἀνθ᾽ οὗ δεῖ ἅπαντα ταῦτα καταλλάττεσθαι, φρόνησις, καὶ τούτου μὲν καὶ μετὰ τούτου (ὠνούμενά τε καὶ πιπρασκόμενα) τῷ ὄντι καὶ ἀνδρεία κτλ.

18. καὶ παῖδα καὶ ἄνδρα καὶ γυναῖκα: nearly equivalent to ‘not only child but etc.’: παῖδα is put first as the natural object of κολάζειν—‘et nos ergo manum ferulae subduximus’ (Juv. 1. 15).

20. ὑπακούῃ is more than obey: the word means ‘to hear and answer’ (cf. Crito, 43A): tr. ‘respond’, sc. by becoming better (as explained in l. 19).

21. ὡς ἀνίατον ὄνταἀποκτείνειν: Rep. III. 410A τοὺςκατὰ τὴν ψυχὴν κακοφυεῖς καὶ ἀνιάτους αὐτοὶ ἀποκτενοῦσι. In the next line αὐτοῦ in αὐτοῦ πεφυκότος is still this ‘one thing’, viz. ἀνδρὸς ἀρετή.

24. ὡς θαυμάσιοι γίγνονται. The MSS. have ὡς θαυμασίως γίγνονται, which could only mean ‘in what a strange way are produced’—a meaning irrelevant here. The point is that it is θαυμαστόν if ‘good men’—virtue having been proved to be teachable—teach their sons everything except virtue. θαυμάσιοι (with Kroschel and other editors) seems the simplest of the many emendations proposed: cf. Euthyd. 305B θαυμάσιοί εἰσιν οἱ τοιοῦτοι ἄνδρες. The mistake may have arisen from the influence of the common θαυμασίως ὡς. Next best is Hirschig's θαυμασίως γίγνονται ἀγαθοὶ οἱ ἀγαθοὶ (cf. 328Eοὐκ εἶναι ἀνθρωπίνην ἐπιμέλειαν ἀγαθοὶ οἱ ἀγαθοὶ γίγνονται) or θαυμασίως γίγνονται οἱ ἀγαθοὶ ἀγαθοί: cf. Meno, 89B οἱ ἀγαθοὶ ἀγαθοὶ γίγνονται and Heindorf's emendation on 326Cbelow. As to γίγνονται ‘Saepius a Platone id quod argumentatione colligitur, γίγνεσθαι dicitur, ut p. 355Aφημὶ ὑμῖν τούτου οὕτως ἔχοντος γελοῖον τὸν λόγον γίγνεσθαι ὅταν λέγητε κτλ., Euthyd. p. 298E οὐκοῦν κύων πατὴρ ὢν σός ἐστιν, ὥστε σὸς πατὴρ γίγνεται κύων’ (Kroschel). The same use of γίγνεσθαι is common in Aristotle.

27. τὰ μὲν ἄλλα ἄρα. For the form of the sentence and for ἄρα here and in l. 33 cf. note on Crito, 50E πρὸς μὲν ἄρα.

28. διδάσκονται (but not of course ἄρα) is interrogative: so οὐ διδάσκονται in l. 33.

29. ἐφ᾽ . This, and not ἐφ᾽ ὦν (as asserted by Schanz), is after all the reading of B: see Adamson in Cl. Rev. VII, 445. In itself, ἐφ᾽ ὧν (so T) is not indefensible: ἐφ᾽ ὧν (i.e. ἐπὶ τούτων κτλ. would mean ‘in the case of subjects which if they have not learnt’ (μὴ μαθοῦσι), the latent depending on μαθοῦσι. This use of ἐπὶ with the genitive is common in Plato, e.g. Rep. VII. 524E ὥσπερ ἐπὶ τοῦ δακτύλου ἐλέγομεν. But ἐφ᾽ (which Heindorf had already conjectured) is simpler and better. For the misplacement of τε in τε ζημία see note on 316Dabove.

32. ὡς ἔπος εἰπεῖν is to be taken with ξυλλήβδην, which goes with the verbal noun ἀνατροπαί: ‘almost wholesale subversion of their house’. ξυλλήβδην means ‘not κατὰ σμικρόν, but so as to embrace everything’: cf. Rep. 1. 344AB τυραννὶς οὐ κατὰ σμικρὸν τἀλλότρια καὶ λάθρᾳ καὶ βίᾳ ἀφαιρεῖταιἀλλὰ ξυλλήβδην, and Theognis, 147 ἐν δὲ δικαιοσύνῃ συλλήβδην πᾶσ᾽ ἀρετὴ 'νι. For ὡς ἔπος εἰπεῖν see on 317A

34. οἴεσθαί γε χρή: a way of answering one's own question: Crito, 53D, 54B.

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hide References (26 total)
  • Commentary references from this page (26):
    • Plato, Republic, 413e
    • Plato, Republic, 410a
    • Plato, Republic, 501b
    • Plato, Republic, 524e
    • Plato, Republic, 565e
    • Plato, Crito, 43a
    • Plato, Crito, 50e
    • Plato, Crito, 53d
    • Plato, Meno, 89b
    • Plato, Meno, 93d
    • Plato, Protagoras, 316d
    • Plato, Protagoras, 328d
    • Plato, Euthydemus, 305b
    • Plato, Gorgias, 523a
    • Plato, Protagoras, 313a
    • Plato, Protagoras, 317a
    • Plato, Protagoras, 319d
    • Plato, Protagoras, 319e
    • Plato, Protagoras, 320a
    • Plato, Protagoras, 323e
    • Plato, Protagoras, 324e
    • Plato, Protagoras, 325b
    • Plato, Protagoras, 326c
    • Plato, Protagoras, 328e
    • Plato, Protagoras, 344a
    • Plato, Protagoras, 355a
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