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πρὸς δ᾽ αὐτοῖς κτλ. Plato is doubtless thinking of the Acropolis and the Dionysiac theatre. Cobet does ill to bracket τοῦ ψόγου καὶ ἐπαίνου: for Plato characteristically makes the rocks themselves applaud. Cf. VIII 563 C. Translate ‘Yea, and besides themselves, the rocks and the place wherein they are resound and give forth a reduplicated uproar of censure and applause.’ Cf. Euthyd. 303 B ἐνταῦθα δὲ ὀλίγου καὶ οἱ κίονες οἱ ἐν τῷ Λυκείῳ ἐθορύβησάν τ᾽ ἐπὶ τοῖν ἀνδροῖν καὶ ἥσθησαν.

τίνα -- ἴσχειν. ‘Where, think you, is a young man's heart?’ For the saying cf. Isocr. Trap. 10 τίν᾽ οἴεσθέ με γνώμην ἔχειν; and Dem. adv. Aphob. II 21 τίν̓ οἴεσθε αὐτὴν ψυχὴν ἔξειν; καρδία as the seat of courage is colloquial and rare: cf. Archil. Fr. 58. 4 καρδίης πλέος and Plut. Reg. et imp. apophthegmata 185 E τοὺς δὲ Ἐρετριεῖςἔλεγεν ὥσπερ τευθίδας μάχαιραν μὲν ἔχειν, καρδίαν δὲ μὴ ἔχειν. q has τίνα ἂν οἴει, and Bywater and Herwerden propose τίν᾽ ἂν οἴει, but the MS reading is better and more picturesque.

ποίαν ἄν. I agree with Goodwin (MT. pp. 66, 68, 71) and others that ἄν with the future was occasionally used by the best Attic prose writers. In Plato it occurs Ap. 29 C, 30 B, Symp. 222 A, Rep. X 615 D, Crito 53 D, Euthyd. 287 D, Phaedr. 227 B, and probably also elsewhere. All these instances have been ‘emended,’ and it is possible enough that some of them are corrupt. Here ἄν is in all the MSS, and is therefore better retained, although it may of course be an erroneous repetition of the last syllable of ποίαν (as Cobet and others suppose). We may regard the idiom as one of Plato's numerous half-poetical efforts: see X 615 D note Richards proposes δή: but see V 450 C note

καὶ φήσειν κτλ. In oratio recta the whole sentence would have run ποία ἂν αὐτῷ παιδεία ἰδιωτικὴ ἀνθέξει, οὐ κατακλυσθεῖσαοἰχήσεται φερομένηκαὶ φήσεικαὶ ἐπιτηδεύσεικαὶ ἔσται τοιοῦτος; i.e. (literally translated) ‘what private training of his will stand fast, which will not be swamped by such censure or praise, and carried down the stream wherever the stream leads, and he will say’ etc. (The metaphor is from a mole or breakwater swept away by a flood.) In this there is nothing but the common passage of a relative into a main sentence (see II 357 B note and cf. Ap. 40 A with my note ad loc.), coupled with an easy change of subject, as in Crito 46 A. The sentence assumes the form which it has in the text, because both subordinate and main clauses can take the accusative with infinitive in Greek oratio obliqua: see Kühner Gr. Gr. II p. 1056. Stallbaum (followed by J. and C.) understands οὐκ οἴει to account for φήσειν, but the negative cannot be supplied, and if it could, it would give a wrong sense. Schneider's translation is correct, but not his note in the text. With the sentiment cf. Gorg. 510 D ff.

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hide References (7 total)
  • Commentary references from this page (7):
    • Plato, Apology, 29c
    • Plato, Apology, 40a
    • Plato, Phaedrus, 227b
    • Plato, Symposium, 222a
    • Plato, Euthydemus, 287d
    • Plato, Euthydemus, 303b
    • Plato, Gorgias, 510d
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