Gonzalez Lodge, Commentary on Plato: Gorgias

ἡ ῥητορικὴ κτἑ.: the first definition which had its origin in the technic of the rhetorical schools (see on 453 a) has now acquired a more exact and complete expression by the help of this dialectical investigation. Note the change from περὶ τῶν δικαίων to περὶ τὸ δίκαιον. Cf. 454 b, e.

πειστικός: able to persuade. Equiv. to ἱκανὸς πείθειν, as διδασκαλικός to διδασκαλίαν παρέχων or ἱκανὸς διδάσκειν. Neither this nor πιστευτικός used above can properly be construed with the genitive. With διδασκαλικός, however, we find examples, as Euthyph. 3 c Ἀθηναίοις οὐ σφόδρα μέλει, ἄν τινα δεινὸν οἴωνται εἶναι μὴ μέντοι διδασκαλικὸν τῆς αὑτοῦ σοφίας. See Kr. 47, 26, 9; H. 754, b. In the addition of μόνον lies a gentle intimation of some defect, the result of which for the estimation of rhetoric appears more plainly later.

ἐν ὀλίγῳ χρόνῳ: draws attention to a great defect of the Athenian judicial system. It was often impossible to present before the court a clear exposition of the points at issue, as the speeches were limited to a certain length, which was carefully measured by the κλέψυδρα,—a practice which Socrates also complains of in Apol. 19 a ἐπιχειρητέον ὑμῶν ἐξελέσθαι τὴν διαβολὴν ἣν ὑμεῖς ἐν πολλῷ χρόνῳ ἔσχετε, ταύτην ἐν οὕτως ὀλίγῳ χρόνῳ, and 37 a ὑμᾶς τοῦτο οὐ πείθω: ὀλίγον γὰρ χρόνον διειλέγμεθα.

φέρε δὴ κτἑ.: introduces a new discussion designed to test the definition just obtained, which, although from the point of view of form it satisfies excellently the double requirement made above in 454 a, still leaves some uncertainty as to the exact meaning of Gorgias. Hence the question, ‘What do we really mean thereby?’ Socrates professes to be not yet quite certain himself (οὐδ᾽ αὐτός), notwithstanding that he has contributed the most to the more close definition of the ποῖον. His doubts are directed especially to the περὶ τί as it has been just defined according to the specifications made by Gorgias. This discussion forms the transition to the examination of the true value and ethical tendency of rhetoric. On the use of καί in questions, cf. Xen. Hell. iii. 3. 11 τέλος αὐτὸν (τὸν Κινάδωνα) ἤροντο (οἱ ἔφοροι) τί καὶ βουλόμενος ταῦτα πράττοι, what purpose he actually had in so doing.